[Mrhowe]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

I agree with marsh on this, while i am very open to giving the new map a try once the server changes i cant see it coming out as this godly map that will save LL it limits our creativity and i feel it spoon feeds us too many pre decorated buildings, we cant just instantly assume that we will be able to contact the map author to change the things we dislike.

[Markus]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

I agree with marsh on this, while i am very open to giving the new map a try once the server changes i cant see it coming out as this godly map that will save LL it limits our creativity and i feel it spoon feeds us too many pre decorated buildings, we cant just instantly assume that we will be able to contact the map author to change the things we dislike.

I mean, I think of it as an option that we could try. I don't think we're ever going to find the perfect map that everyone will like unless we create something based on the input of everyone.

[Dick]

At the end of the day - Any map LimeLight picks people aren't going to be happy. We have jumped maps more than I have rejoined the Teacher Team and that's a fact.

The map changes we have done in the past have changed the way we roleplay drastically. EvoCity provided a linear path of being almost a single road, allowing for checkpoints to make sense and prevent criminals from getting away. Rockford allowed the open streets for criminals to drive around the map and those who have expert driving skills or are able to outwit the Police were successful in keeping themselves safe. TrueNorth had a similar feeling to Rockford however with the large map size it also opened for more discrete operations and additional things to add such as the Mine allowing for mining and the large lakes and canals allowing for different fishing spots.

At the end of the day, the only way I see people, everyone, at least becoming slightly happy is having the map rotation suggestion which has previously been discussed. Hoping from one map to another kinda gets old especially when you spend time over months or years in certain cases in the hopes you'll eventually return to Evocity or Rockford or TrueNorth, etc etc. Southside looks like a great map and I am sure it will do well for a couple of months but this happens with every map.

[MrMarsh]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

I agree with marsh on this, while i am very open to giving the new map a try once the server changes i cant see it coming out as this godly map that will save LL it limits our creativity and i feel it spoon feeds us too many pre decorated buildings, we cant just instantly assume that we will be able to contact the map author to change the things we dislike.

I mean, I think of it as an option that we could try. I don't think we're ever going to find the perfect map that everyone will like unless we create something based on the input of everyone.

Sure we could try but this is not a debate wethe or not we could try. This is a discussion about wether or not we want this current version of southside.



On an other note regarding the building space:

In this debate i often hear...

use rooftops
use the water
use the parking lots

we could adjust the map

... when it comes to my argument about the map having little to no building spaces. But as of right now we cant adjust the map, the parking spots still are very small with large sourrounding props. the water still has no road access and it would still (and allways will be) extremely unrealistic/out of place to spawn most the dupes we have right now on rooftops.

As i said people are welcome to proof me wrong - in dact i urge people to do so. Because it doesnt come to my mind where i could properly setup a structure with a 8x8 or better 16x8 footprint without looking completely out of place or obstructing other stuff.

This debate is wether or not we want this very map. It includes a consideration of wether or not we value building space / to which degree we are willing to trade it for some premade features etc.

As for the lack of building space it is going to be hard to proof a negative... but believe me i spent quite some time trying to build shit on southside and came up without a single satisfying result so before people try to negate this argument by going "you could possibly build there..." i would love to see them try.

Im not saying that one couldnt possibly setup a hotdog stand - or furnish an appartment. Im saying that it is unreasonably difficult and in some cases entirely impossible to setup a variety of dupes that used to create core-roleplays.

[Mrhowe]

I agree with marsh on this, while i am very open to giving the new map a try once the server changes i cant see it coming out as this godly map that will save LL it limits our creativity and i feel it spoon feeds us too many pre decorated buildings, we cant just instantly assume that we will be able to contact the map author to change the things we dislike.

I mean, I think of it as an option that we could try. I don't think we're ever going to find the perfect map that everyone will like unless we create something based on the input of everyone.

Sure we could try but this is not a debate wethe or not we could try. This is a discussion about wether or not we want this current version of southside.



On an other note regarding the building space:

In this debate i often hear...

use rooftops
use the water
use the parking lots

we could adjust the map

... when it comes to my argument about the map having little to no building spaces. But as of right now we cant adjust the map, the parking spots still are very small with large sourrounding props. the water still has no road access and it would still (and allways will be) extremely unrealistic/out of place to spawn most the dupes we have right now on rooftops.

As i said people are welcome to proof me wrong - in dact i urge people to do so. Because it doesnt come to my mind where i could properly setup a structure with a 8x8 or better 16x8 footprint without looking completely out of place or obstructing other stuff.

This debate is wether or not we want this very map. It includes a consideration of wether or not we value building space / to which degree we are willing to trade it for some premade features etc.

As for the lack of building space it is going to be hard to proof a negative... but believe me i spent quite some time trying to build shit on southside and came up without a single satisfying result so before people try to negate this argument by going "you could possibly build there..." i would love to see them try.

Im not saying that one couldnt possibly setup a hotdog stand - or furnish an appartment. Im saying that it is unreasonably difficult and in some cases entirely impossible to setup a variety of dupes that used to create core-roleplays.

exactly. this server is meant to be about rp so its oddly infuriating hearing people say 'build on the roofs', 'build on the water' alot of the places i build would not be found on a rooftop infact i dont think many places at all would be found on a rooftop. for builders that build passive dupes for stuff like resturants, casinos, stores in general building on the water or building on the rooftops instantly limits our rp as theres no room to build our dupes where the main population of players probably will be. (on the ground/ not floating above the lake with some shoddy prop road.)

[Ketchup]

For the government, a multi-level PD, with an elevator. Sick, I know. Interrogation rooms, similar to TrueNorth's. Firing Range, Locker Room and Armoury. Offices, which remind me of Season 1 of Line of Duty (UK),

b e n t    c o p p e r s

[Quest]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

[Bambo]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

[Quest]

We can not simply "ask the author" as much as i would love that. The author is a free human beeing with no association to limelight. Why would he bother? We could try to pay him - sure. But generally he would need to be open for this. We cant tell that yet. Also things like this do take time. Since it probably wouldnt be too simple to edit the map if the author would want to stick to the overall quality of it. This stuff takes time - if we are lucky enough to get there.

This could theoreticly be an option  - nothing more than an option though. We dont have that yet nor can we be certain that we will get that at any time (FL is a good example of how/why map editing can be a bit complicated at times).

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

[Guv]

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

im sure a few other people have mentioned this, that contacting the map author is a very hard and time consuming process and it would take time for him to do something like this and might not even do it anyway for the likes of 1 community.

[Nudel]

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

You still have to download a "custom" version then?

[Quest]

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

im sure a few other people have mentioned this, that contacting the map author is a very hard and time consuming process and it would take time for him to do something like this and might not even do it anyway for the likes of 1 community.

Adding him on steam isn't a long and time consuming process. I've contacted plenty of map/addon creators before on gmod and I still don't think you're reading what I'm saying. I said that we could contact the map creator for permission to edit the map ourselves  within hammer. 

[Quest]

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

You still have to download a "custom" version then?

Ofcourse you do but it's not the same as spending hours and hours or spending a lot of money creating a fully custom map, that was not my point. My point is you can just use hammer and remove some buildings in order to create building space for RP.

[Bambo]

But what is reasonable is asking the author if one of us could edit the map ourselves with his permission

Custom maps are not a feasible option regardless of who makes them.

We either need to have a huge average player count that keeps the server going without needing new players as new players won't subscribe to a map to join a new community or the map needs to be so good that people subscribe to it on its own to the level of the original map.

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

It's not exactly "custom" if you're just removing a couple buildings in hammer. I don't think you understood where I'm coming from, I was just suggesting that it would be possible to contact the map author and ask permission to remove a few buildings ourselves in Hammer to create building space for players.

It's a customized version of a map that is 1GB of size as I mentioned in my post;

Keep in mind that Southside is nearly 1 GB. No one will download a custom version of a map with such a big size to test a server out.
Even if you remove bits and pieces, the size is still going to be huge, alongside a lot of content that already needs subscribing.

So the issue remaining is people will still have to subscribe to a customized version of the map. We have talented map creators like Project that can do this fairly easily but it's not a reasonable option to do it as we unfortunately do not have the community to carry a customized map.

[C Lee]

South Side is a 1gb? Lol, how did that happen?