[Quest]

Reported Players: Ollie630 (STEAM_0:1:59960025) (@Ollie630)
Server: Rockford
Time: 2018-Jun-20 19:48
Summary: FearRP.
I was blacklisted by Toxic for the same reason.
Under gun point, told to get into the car, fails to get into the car and hops in his mates car ( who he contacted previously, likely whilst handcuffed via a third party, in order to get him to pick him up).
Although Jono said it wasn't a violation of FearRP I spoke to another staff member and was told to create a PR as it is in a grey area of FearRP. However if this is denied, then surely my past blacklist should also be removed?
Evidence:

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[Jono]

I should deny this on the premise that this has already been denied. 

Furthermore, the verdict was deliberated upon by other staff due to it's nature. Your previous blacklist is irrelevant to the outcome of this case. You're welcome to submit an Unblacklist request to have it striked off your record if you feel it's fit.


But I shall let another staff member review this further as (not) to set precedent.

[Bambo]

8. Do not post reports if you know the incident has been dealt with in-game by members of staff, because you do not agree with the outcome or otherwise.


Also,

2.1 - You are considered to be under FearRP when you are in line of sight of a visibly armed person, who is within microphone range of you and is able to harm your character at that moment. You must act afraid of armed people and life-threatening situations. You must follow the orders of the person(s) who have you under FearRP, and you may not draw a weapon on them or attack them. FearRP applies to melee weapons and tasers if you are within effective range (except if in a vehicle). You may not run away from someone who has you under FearRP and is pointing a gun/taser at you, unless they specifically order you to. You are not under FearRP if you are also visibly armed. Visibly armed in the context of this rule means that you have your weapon out and in your hands, regardless of safety mode. You are not considered visibly armed when you are seated in a vehicle, regardless of whether you are holding a weapon in hand or not. If someone switches from a gun to handcuffs/rope to detain you, FearRP still applies.

Anything else to add?

[Quest]

@Bambo 
He was cuffed and therefore he had to follow my orders. In addition he contacted his mate via third party and I did have a shotgun in various moments.

Tell me: 
How is he supposed to get inside my car as I can't physically keep him under FearRP 24/7.

I'd rather you just not conclude this right away and we can actually have a discussion about it as I was also blacklisted for a similar reason ( I hopped in a car whilst I was handcuffed and the cop was switching tools, technically I wasn't under fearRP; but according to @Toxic I was - and I do agree with him that I was).
(For reference: 

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Although it did seem to happen a little faster it is a similar grey situation.

[Bambo]

@Bambo 
He was cuffed and therefore he had to follow my orders. In addition he contacted his mate via third party and I did have a shotgun in various moments.

I'm stating the rule which points out he doesn't. If you have any evidence for the third party claim, please share.

Tell me: 
How is he supposed to get inside my car as I can't physically keep him under FearRP 24/7.

Your partner places him inside the car while you wait in.

I'd rather you just not conclude this right away and we can actually have a discussion about it as I was also blacklisted for a similar reason ( I hopped in a car whilst I was handcuffed and the cop was switching tools, technically I wasn't under fearRP; but according to @Toxic I was - and I do agree with him that I was).
(For reference: 

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Although it did seem to happen a little faster it is a similar grey situation.

First of all, that's for a UBL however, I'd like to state, that's not the same thing.

You broke "If someone switches from a gun to handcuffs/rope to detain you, FearRP still applies." part of the rule, while you claim Ollie360 broke FearRP by not following you while you were inside your car which our rule clearly states;

"You are not considered visibly armed when you are seated in a vehicle, regardless of whether you are holding a weapon in hand or not."

Not grey area, clear as day.

Now, any further disputing your previous blacklist should be done in a UBLR and not here.

If nothing else is to be added, I'll be denying this due to you breaking the PR Rules as well as it just not being a rule breakage.

[Quest]

@Bambo 
Which PR Rule am I breaking? I was told to make a PR and thus I created a PR. 

I am using my rule break to show that what they did was against the rules 

It is clear they used a third party due to the car PULLING UP AS HE JUMPED OUT.

Like I said, tell me: How am I supposed to get him in my car if he's handcuffed when I physically can't.

[Bambo]

@Bambo 
Which PR Rule am I breaking? I was told to make a PR and thus I created a PR. 

8. Do not post reports if you know the incident has been dealt with in-game by members of staff, because you do not agree with the outcome or otherwise.

I am using my rule break to show that what they did was against the rules 

It is clear they used a third party due to the car PULLING UP AS HE JUMPED OUT.

That is loose evidence sadly. Need more.

Like I said, tell me: How am I supposed to get him in my car if he's handcuffed when I physically can't.

Partners can do it, if not agree to it in LOOC and use /me and then unlock your car.

[Bambo]

Going to deny this on the basis that it mainly broke PR Rule;

8. Do not post reports if you know the incident has been dealt with in-game by members of staff, because you do not agree with the outcome or otherwise.

Also no rule breakage was shown in the PR.

Denied.