[Mustang]

Name: [L²:RP] Mustang

Time/Date:  Approx 6.PM 15/03/16 - UK Format.

Steam ID:  
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Limelight - Link watcher

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Name of Administrator: [font='Lucida Sans Unicode', 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif][L²] Enzyme[/font]

Evidence: Enzyme gave himself a concussion grenade and threw it in the middle of the street. To my knowledge without any RP reason which effected many people around trying to RP. Eg, Me. I parked my car up as a crowd was gathering and I believed I saw someone assault someone so I went to investigate when Enzyme, using admin powers gave himself a concussion grenade and threw it down in the street as I believe a civilian however have no proof of the current job name.

Proof in the form of screenshots: 

Spoiler

 

[Enzyme]

I actually spawn two concussion grenades if I recall correctly. My job was also Citizen.

It's hard to tell what's going on by the screenshots but there was a massive gathering where people were minging around creeping around two  female players in female skins. The behaviour was inappropriate and I told people to stop that behaviour. I could have used my physgun at that point to move the trouble-makers away but it was hard to keep track of all the people who were doing this. After throwing down the concussion grenades, I activated no-clip and got people to stop talking so I could tell them to stop acting like they did.

I admit that I should not have used a concussion grenade to resolve the situation, but I found it to be a tool that had high likelihood to make people spread out and stop the minging that was taking place (which worked). I wanted to sort out a rather awkward situation without having to bring more attention to the players who were getting this treatment from the "young lads" who were trying to take pictures of the cleavage and ass of the female player-model (this can be seen taking place in evidence-picture #1 and #4)

I need to point out that the pictures was taken at the end of the incident. I'm making this assumption because of how you only saw one concussion grenade being thrown, as well that the Police had arrived at this time, which didn't occur before the group had already split up.
I see in the last picture of the logs that you took quite a few screenshots. Does the other screenshots show the crowd and situation before the Police arrived?


If any other player was around to witness the situation then please post below to explain what was taking place from your perspective. This is to give the reviewing SA a proper picture of the situation. Thank you.

[Post updated to elaborate a bit more]

[Mustang]

Isn't it as easy to mute people by looking at the chat box to get them to stop talking or to just talk louder or type in local ooc. A concussion grenade really is not needed, never mind two. To be honest this effected some RP's around in the area for example mine when I arrived at the scene to try sort it out ICly I was blasted by a concussion grenade. Something which is used in raids and not out in the street.

Edit: I was not around for the full scene explained by Enzyme with the female models/characters. I arrived when I seen a crowd which is when I witnessed the concussion grenade.

[Enzyme]

I've updated my first post to explain the situation in better detail.

[Dick]

- I saw from a distance and was on the government side -

When I saw the current situation I was wondering what was going on and I just saw a group of people with Enzyme giving him a parade(which I was ever imformed of :P) but from what it was it was a massive gather that the police officers was just about to get into to clear off as there was some massive disturbance there. I was in teamspeak at the times with a few people as it started. I was unable to obverve the full thing however I was heard a grenade explosion thinking that the S.W.A.T's where just being idiots and throwing equipment until I noticed it coming from the crowd.

After two went off, the area seemed to clear up and I was uncertain to what happened.

This is from what I saw and heard over government radio chatter

[Mustang]

From what I can see in Evidence Picture #1 is that there is a total of 13 people in the screenshot (not including me). There seems to be three people minding their business or just standing about and one officer walking past. There is a group of five people beside the situation that you used a concussion grenade for, this group of five people seem to be in their own roleplay and around the female models there is only two other people (not including Red dress and black dress) so the situation that you used a concussion grenade or even two for really doesn't seem that big. There is also One female model taking pictures of another female model with two people around in suits, one of which is dancing, there is only 3 people around the female model, one of which being another female. The other groups are seen to be ignoring these females as they have their backs turned and are in their own circle so it looks as if this could be solved with a physgun as from what I can see there is only a group of 3/4 involved in this, 1 of which is the victim, shall we say of this harassment (Red dress). The need for a concussion grenade is really very highly unneeded and which disrupted a big area around were people were trying to go about their daily life.

[Enzyme]

As I wrote in my first post and something that you said yourself: you arrived at the end of the situation. I threw 2 concussion grenades and seeing how you only saw one confirms that you weren't there from the start. This is also backed up by how the police have arrived on scene in your evidence; something that didn't happen before people had already started to spread out.

(Written on phone)

[Mustang]

Well from what i can see is that there is absolutely no need for the second concussion grenade, the one that I have screenshot as the situation from what you said seems to not be happening anymore from my provided screenshots bar one or two people.

[loz4432]

Well from my side of the situation I know that these men were following around the women in the first picture and taking pictures of them for quite some time, then Enzyme threw a concussion grenade, which was quite helpful because it meant that the players left the area and the women were able to easily escape the situation. Also, I only witnessed one concussion grenade and did not see the other.

[Barkles]

from what enzyme explained it as it seems more of an unorthadox punishment. Im not really seeing any abuse as such as that would infer that he was using them to gain advantage over something or just to be a dick. Although unorthadox punishments are called such as they do often bend what is normal for administrator staff. however it is easy for other users to see it as abuse.

just my 2 cents

[Vauld]

I was present at the discussed situation and was also rather confused by the use of a concussion grenade. I was a police officer and approached what was referred to as a "Riot" in the police radio. We began to tell the crowd to disperse and pulled out batons, at around that time is when the second concussion grenade was thrown by Enzyme. It seemed rather inappropriate seeing as everything could've been dealt with in character.

However, to be fair to Enzyme it did seem a little on the mingey side, so it's not far out that an admin would intervene to disperse the crowd. Using a concussion grenade is a bit over the top, because it also affects those who aren't minging. Is it abuse though? No not really, it's not like he's using it to his advantage or anything of the sort. Was it unnecessary? Probably, but we all do something a bit over the top occasionally. Didn't really concern me to be honest. On the flip side, I do understand your frustration and it was probably a bit annoying. But as for abuse, nahhhh.

[Mustang]

This was posted as abuse as at the time I seen it as going against this point 

Messing around, for example killing other admins or using punishment commands for the fun of it, etc.

I knew that a normal SWAT agent who threw a concussion grenade in the street would get punished and was un-aware of the reasons. 

I do understand that concussion grenade #1 may have been needed from what has been explained here however when the situation turns IC, as Vauld has stated, when the police come to disperse the crowd there really isn't a need, I don't see it as an unorthdox punishment at this point as well, who's it punishing? It seems more as messing about from my point of view when I arrived.

[Faustie]

I wasn't at this exact situation and there's no video footage so it's difficult to ascertain the actual situation and just how appropriate a concussion grenade was, but given my past experience I'd say that it would be acceptable to use them as an unorthodox administrative tool in certain scenarios. An admin has a lot of resources at his disposal, but the majority of them are for dealing with individual players; we don't design most of our admin tools with crowd control in mind because it would affect too many innocent players. This is why we don't have commands to mute or freeze in a certain radius, for example. A concussion grenade, while not an administrative tool, is excellent for IC crowd control and could be used by an admin to get the attention of a crowd OOC. It's faster than muting all of the individual players and is less disruptive as it doesn't show up to the entire server and is more forgiving than a kick/mute.

[Mustang]

This I understand, whoever as seen in Screenshot#1 there is around 2 people in that area of the female player models. Two people do not need a concussion grenade.

[Enzyme]

I need to point out again Mustang that you weren't there when the situation was at it's worst, and I also need to point out that you entered the situation with a lack of context and that you've made up your mind about the situation without sitting on all the information surrounding this episode.

/Phone