Quote:which i believe led to the retaliation of the police.
we wasn't told they was going to tow it until after they was in cuffs, at that point anyone would lie to not go to jail, im my point of view it looked like they was attempting to block us in.
(Jan 12, 2020, 07:07 PM)Riggs Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:which i believe led to the retaliation of the police.
we wasn't told they was going to tow it until after they was in cuffs, at that point anyone would lie to not go to jail, im my point of view it looked like they was attempting to block us in.
*Doubt*
The attached video by Astro heavily contradicts that in the first 10 seconds.
"Literally using a Tow hook to get the fire truck" - Me
"I've just tested to drive it and its driven fine" - You
"We're moving it out" - Darius. All before you handcuffed us and say that we're under arrest.
(Jan 14, 2020, 03:17 PM)Riggs Wrote: [ -> ]![[Image: 9dTDU1W.png]](https://i.imgur.com/9dTDU1W.png)
you guys at 0:03 in the vid start saying it, AFTER we have the driver under gunpoint ^
*visible confusion*
Why would we block in a truck we had already agreed to move, we had no qualms with it, we were towing it out as the rescue truck has a tow hook on it.
We weren't in cuffs yet and had no reason to suspect we would be arrested.
And who pulls a gun on a firefighter
(Jan 14, 2020, 04:57 PM)astro2k Wrote: [ -> ] (Jan 14, 2020, 03:17 PM)Riggs Wrote: [ -> ]
you guys at 0:03 in the vid start saying it, AFTER we have the driver under gunpoint ^
*visible confusion*
Why would we block in a truck we had already agreed to move, we had no qualms with it, we were towing it out as the rescue truck has a tow hook on it.
We weren't in cuffs yet and had no reason to suspect we would be arrested.
And who pulls a gun on a firefighter
a fire engine is a heavy car/truck and it is classed as a deadly weapon
(Jan 14, 2020, 05:30 PM)Riggs Wrote: [ -> ] (Jan 14, 2020, 04:57 PM)astro2k Wrote: [ -> ] (Jan 14, 2020, 03:17 PM)Riggs Wrote: [ -> ]
you guys at 0:03 in the vid start saying it, AFTER we have the driver under gunpoint ^
*visible confusion*
Why would we block in a truck we had already agreed to move, we had no qualms with it, we were towing it out as the rescue truck has a tow hook on it.
We weren't in cuffs yet and had no reason to suspect we would be arrested.
And who pulls a gun on a firefighter
a fire engine is a heavy car/truck and it is classed as a deadly weapon
We weren't using it as a deadly weapon, we were using it... as it's intended purpose.
Pro tip: don't stand right in front of a fire truck, directly under the windshield is a blind spot, in the screenshot you took it would be hard for the driver to recognise if you were there, let alone if you had a gun or something out.
Not only that but you were previously inside the fire station testing the fire truck with an invalid justification. You choosing to walk into the path of danger is on yourself. No one else.
Then using that poor decision making to justify an arrest is even more deplorable, especially when the truck was already stopped and I was using the tow, which is made clear by not only the video, but the fact that we vocalised our intentions throughout the entire RP.
Again.
You wanted us to move the truck.
You voided our RP by using a game mechanic. In light of that we offered to move the truck via tow, as again it was broken in our RP *see oil on floor and the details given to you by the engineer, Darius*
We go to move the truck, as per your original orders. You arrest us.
Worst of all, you didn't even arrest the owner of the damn truck, instead you arrested the two people trying to move it.
Drop the technicalities, it's worthless in this debate. I'm tired of justifying who said what, and who did what.
Not only that. But yesterday I saw Guv had spawned the same dupe. And a extension had been made for a fourth vehicle. Specifically Inserts GMC Ambulance. Why wasn't this an option at the time of our RP?
We made it perfectly clear what we were doing. We radioed that we were doing a training exercise. We made it clear in our meeting the trucks were broken. We made it clear via props. There is no debate here. Trying to base an argument on what you think your persona in character could of perceived is complete and utter bollocks. You arrested us for serving the purpose of the game. Role-playing.
I see no reason to comment further. Everything that can or could be said, has been said. Moreover, logs have revealed a deeper truth via PM's and radio chat that we missed.
Well, this is an interesting case. We've had some discussion internally, and a few points have been raised.
This is the exact sort of situation which makes staff supportive of moving forward with a police whitelist, reverting "arrests are IC", and various other changes made to make RP more open. Instead of making RP more open, in this case, it forced the ending of the RP. No matter if this report is approved or denied, I'd like to make it known that I am extremely disappointed in this situation. There were multiple options to prevent this from escalating in this way. However, when people enter the RP with how they're "fucking done", complaining that the team isn't being ran to your exact specifications, about how "YOUR FUCKING TRUCKS ARE IN THE WRONG BAYS" and how the team are all "fucking idiots". That sets the scene, sets expectations. From what I've read, you wanted to go that, wanting a confrontation. It's the equivalent of the Corleones standing outside their buildings armed with AKs, and the only reason it's deemed acceptable is because your a Police Officer. The same group that will shoot people for car theft or arrest tornados for property damage.
And despite this, the group attempted to follow your commands, whilst still upholding their RP, and the IC actions, to which you even admit. You had told them to move their vehicle, they got a vehicle to tow it. You arrested them for that. For "obstruction of justace & emergency services, failing to comply with police oders". They followed your orders. And obstructing emergency services? Guv is a paramedic, that falls under the Fire Chief. That is their right to do.
So now we're here.
And I get to decide if this falls under 11.3, 3.1 or any of the rules noted in the report.
Whether this was malicious, or if the effects were big enough to warrant a punishment.
Or, if it was just incompetence on multiple levels.
Well, lets look.
This was an ongoing situation. You started at least 15 minutes before the arrests occurred. That's not heat of the moment.
You were directly communicating with Guv. You tried to speak to the President about it. You were already yelling down the radio at them. To me, that shows pre-meditation.
You got to the scene, what happened was explained to you. Twice, at least, from what I've read. Sure, don't believe them. But you don't get arrested for not believing someone. That's not affirmation of a crime.
You stated the vehicle needed to be moved. You were told (either before or after, or possibly both), that it was immobile. They got a vehicle to tow it, either after asking for a tow or not. Either way, doesn't matter. They were following your orders as closely as they could. And for that, you arrested them.
For following your orders, they got arrested.
So, we can confirm here that 3.1 was breached, as was 11.3. I'm not going to bother with 3.3, 3.4 or 3.9 here.
We have to see if this was a result of your incompetence, or if it was malicious. Obviously I wasn't there on the server, so we have to take what we've got (both in priors and pre-meditation) into account. Your priors? Excessive use of force, excessive corruption. Over escalation. Invalid raid reasons. RDM. Insults. Slurs. Disrespect. More use of force. More insults. Misuse of weapons. Lots of malicious actions. Overall, you only have two less punishments than both Pufitee and John Jong. Taking that into account, I've come to the decision that this will be treated as malicious.
Now, to Guv. I understand the annoyance with a station not being ran your way. But you're not the Chief. If you don't like that, have a meeting, resign, speak to the President. Take reasonable escalation of IC steps. But to call a cop, complain, and say nothing as they're arrested. In fact, to demand that "these guys done for obstructing emergency operations", when that's their complete right to do so as your chief? Let me refer you back above. I am extremely disappointed in this situation. In fact, disappointed doesn't get close to cutting it here. You're a teacher. Your entire role is to promote RP. To bring people in and experience things they wouldn't normally RP. And a department RPing being underfunded is something that I haven't seen done well on LL before. And to kill that, because it goes against the RP you want to do is, to put it in one word, disgusting.
With your relevant levels of experience, you should know better. You both, should know better.
Player Report Approved.
Riggs will be issued a Police Officer blacklist.
Guv will be issued a permanent warning.